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on this topic, why is the violent option in not recommended? that's the ONLY way i'll put any of my fish to sleep. screw messing around with different chemicals hoping they'll "go to sleep"! yes it's gruesome, but if done swiftly and in a matter of seconds then i don't see any reason why it should be in that category? i read somewhere that fish can still "feel" when treated with clove oil, i equate it to being gassed --Cat 15:45, 6 December 2007 (CST)

I'm not a professional on this subject so I suggest you read some of the external links on this subject to see what the pros say.

I suspect it's not recommended as it could be a bit hit and miss (no pun intended). Make a mistake and the animal may suffer. Using chemicals like clove oil is what I do. The animal simply seems to slow down and sleep. Indeed Clove oil is used to transport fish by sedating them. Adding more oil stops them breathing so it seems to be painless. There is no 'hoping for the animal to sleep' as you say, it simply does the job everytime. The animal never looks stressed at all.

Hitting the animal means removing it from the water first which perhaps stresses the animal during that short time? Plus larger animals may require physical action greater than the person can assert? Myself, I'd feel personally disturbed having to inflict death on an animal. When I was very young (5 or 6), I remember my father fishing for trout in a river and he would grab each fish by the tail and bang its head against a rock repeatingly to kill it. But I'd see the fish in the boot of the car coming around and gasping for breath. This to me at the time was disturbing and it's memory remains with me. So I can't do it today.

In my view and it's a personal one, Clove oil is the lesser of the evils. But everyone has different viewpoints of course based on their own experiences, upbringing, etc. and each person ultimately does what they feel is best for them. :-)

When I wrote this article, I hoped to be neutral and looked up what small number of articles I could find online and tried to put the list in some sort of order of recommendation based on what these articles said. I welcome anyone else going over these (or other) external links and giving their input. :-)

--Quatermass 04:32, 7 December 2007 (CST)

i've only had small fish to deal with and only had to dispatch sickly fry, so the size issue for me hasn't come up. if i had a large fish with problems i would consult experts. when i have dispatched fry they've only been out of the water for a matter of seconds and wrapped in damp kitchen towel and newspaper (all prepared before hand) before the blow (in the shape of a large heavy hard back book) comes down. the breeder i initially got endlers from employs her eldest son to do the deed! i've also come up again and again on the problem on the availability of clove oil, it's not always possible to find it. --Cat 05:55, 7 December 2007 (CST)

Can I recommend that each method get it's own section of the page with the pros and cons listed under the method? It doesn't sound very neutral to me right now. If I have time and there are no objections maybe I can do it later..... I have also never had a problem getting clove oil . You have to look in alternative stores. Generally ime if a store sells things for yoga and feng shui they probably have a great assortment of oils :lol: ebay sometimes works too :) --Tash 17:14, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

Reorganise[edit source]

Hi Tash,
I think that's a good idea. There is a lot of excellent articles on this sensitive subject and each method deserves a page of their own. So feel free to break it up as you feel fit whenever you've got time.

--Quatermass 18:41, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

ok. Ill do it as soon as I have time. Probably won't go into different pages just yet though. Ill start with just putting them here. --Tash 21:08, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

I got it started. Still needs work though. --Tash 23:19, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

I don't understand the reference "Akin to putting a puppy in an outhouse".

Putting an animal down the toilet is similar to putting an puppy in a shed? I'm from the UK so maybe its a cultural difference?

--Quatermass 12:04, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

It's from the last article "Don't Flush That Fish". I didn't want to say "Porta-Potty" since that is a brand name. Here an outhouse is a generic term for a small building with a toilet seat above a pit of waste. Here an outbuilding would be a shed or similar. There are some photos and more info here: What do you call it? --Tash 13:26, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

I'd call it a 'outside toilet'. :-)

--Quatermass 20:13, 4 April 2010 (UTC)